Something to ponder - Page 3

malaki86 · August 12th, 2008, 11:40 PM

Nope - you can't change the navigation engine to MapPoint. In the nav engine, it lists "None" and "Destinator". You can't add MapPoint.

They do have a MapPoint plugin in the SDK, but it's just that - purely developmental.

If I could import my saved POI's into iGuidance, I'd switch to it in a heartbeat.

i_am_rufus · August 12th, 2008, 11:51 PM

This story kind of reminds me of two interesting situations involving people I know purchasing new cars with navigation....

The first was a Honda Accord Euro (Acura TSX in the U.S. I think). Having already been familiar with the various hidden issues with GPS navigation, I asked the deal how old the maps were. He had no idea, and would "get back to us". This wasn't a deal breaker on buying the car, but would have been interersting to know. As it turned out, the maps were alread 1 and a half years out of date at time of purchase. The car is now 3 months old and a new mapping DVD is now available. Not free though, not even at cost, but at full normal price. Thanks Honda.

The second case was involving a locally made car, that is exported to the U.S. Here it is a Holden Commodore. When the car was first sold, the navigation wasn't ready yet. All the hardware was in the car, so just the software, a gps antenna, and control module, had to be purchaesed as a kit and installed by the dealer. Once again, not a deal breaker in buying the car. The buyer was assured that it would only be about 3 months at most before it was available, and would only be a "small fee" to upgrade. 10 months later the kit was available, and would be a $2500 upgrade!! WOW! Better yet, the maps were also out of date, despite it being a "new kit", and the screen isn't even a touch screen! They forgot to mention all this before hand.

My point being, car navigation seems to be a very difficult industry at the moment. It can be an OEM solution, a Garmen, a Tom Tom, Destinator on your phone, etc, but there are always hidden issues. Hell, my first Car PC a few years ago used CoPilot Laptop 8 - worst routing engine ever!! It was about as close to useless as you could get, was kinda fun though - was always being introduced to new places that I never knew about by it's completly insane routing. I think it is important that all companies that sell navigation make it very clear the date/version of their maps at time of purchase, as it is the maps that make refunds impossable. Not just Flux, but everyone! On the packet for the Tom Tom I buy, on the details for the Honda I buy, they should all make it very clear what the map versions are.

I know how it can be a pain for someone to buy navigation and find the maps are old old old, but from experence I checked before purchasing what the map version was. I always ask now. I'm not saying that the buyer should be expected to ask this, and if they don't then too bad. I am saying, however, that until things are more transparent, then as a buyer you will have to be realistic and ask these questions, ask many questions. Find everything about the product before committing to buy. I understand that Flux is working on the routing engine problem, but I also understand that the age of the maps is out of their hands. I'm realistic. I'd love to get free maps, but it isn't going to happen. I could complain about it for weeks on end, and it still won't happen. I know it won't happen because if Flux was to seriously give everyone free maps, it would actually be easier and cheaper just to shut up shop and go out of business. Some people seem to think that they can just pull these maps out of their ass and hand them out, except they have to buy the maps themselves first. It's just unfortunate that they don't make it crystal clear the versions of the maps on the description for the item before purchase, but like I said, no one does this, and that's not a good thing. Maybe Flux could lead the way in being upfront on map verisons and the wider market might stop trying to pull the wool over peoples eyes all the time.

Number #1 thought on purchasing navigation systems - Buyer Beware!

nemo · August 13th, 2008, 08:30 AM

I don't know of any navigation system that gives you free map updates (With the exception of Garmin; and even that depends on what model you have, and when you purchased it).

So IMO, I can't say you should be surprised that you wont be getting new maps for free. Especially considering that Fluxmedia is so gracious enough to give you a fully featured 30 day trial for their product. The split map system is a problem with Destinator, and not CF. Either way, it is something that you should have seen within the trial.

cluck · August 13th, 2008, 08:42 AM

Buyer Beware! Exactly

I asked Flux what the Map version and vendor was before I purchased. It was fairly current at the time. I also asked for a discount cause I'm a nice guy, they agreed -

I found a newer map version on RapidShare - no problems with that, lots of new streets.

What version is CF offering for US roads ?
I've seen downloads for...
USA 2006.Q2
Eastern Europe 2007.Q1
Australia 2007.Q2
Greece and India 2008.Q1

The map changing issue may be resolved by recompiling or stitching the maps together, has this been investigated ?

malaki86 · August 13th, 2008, 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nemo

I don't know of any navigation system that gives you free map updates (With the exception of Garmin; and even that depends on what model you have, and when you purchased it).

So IMO, I can't say you should be surprised that you wont be getting new maps for free. Especially considering that Fluxmedia is so gracious enough to give you a fully featured 30 day trial for their product. The split map system is a problem with Destinator, and not CF. Either way, it is something that you should have seen within the trial.

I ran the trial for 28 days before I made the purchase. However, unless you live in New York City or Berlin, you can't use the navigation. Even with that, there was NO indication that the maps were split in the final purchased version. I found that out the hard way on the first day...

ivan · August 13th, 2008, 01:24 PM

What makes you think the problems you're having will be resolved with an updated Destinator engine?

I've seen and used v7 and as far as I'm concerned it's a step backwards. The engine is a real resource hog and the map display lags about 5 seconds behind the cars real position.

I'm now using Sygic Drive, embedded in CF. The routing engine may not be the best (IMO only TomTom really works well) but as far as ease of use and features go (varying distances on POIs etc) it's the wasps ankles.

salvi · August 13th, 2008, 01:35 PM

I'm glad I stuck with the standard version and got iGuidance isntead

Tamo · August 13th, 2008, 03:45 PM

I can't help but reading between the lines that everyone's trying to tell malaki to eat the crap he's been fed...

Somehow I get sick of threads where users are praising Flux, even tho the product is merely average quality.

I had so much problems with CF in the last few Updates, especially with the RCs.

Final seems to work for me now, but the other Updates OMG...

I know what you think:
"Why didn't this guy just stick to the "stable" 1.4 or even 1.2 releases?"
Because these weren't stable as well (talk about Phoco!!!) and once you stuck your nose into the RCs, the only way for me to get a downgrade was a Windows-reinstall.

Talk about user-friendly

Anyways, after all this dumping my frustration I gotta say, good work on the recent changes according good BT-Phone support and iPod compatibility.

Greetings
Tamo

coffeejolts · August 13th, 2008, 04:07 PM

The Corvette analogy isn't really appropriate. The bundled maps don't cripple CF, they just are not as current as we'd like them to be. A better analogy would be Chevrolet intoducing the ZR1 the day after selling you a Z06 as the fastest vette available.

In the software world, it is very rare to get a free upgrade for a major release version. For example, I purchased Call of Duty for PC. Did I get a free upgrade to Call of Duty 2 when it came out, or Call of Duty 4 after that? No. Do Windows XP users get a free upgrade to Vista? No.

If you think about it more, you don't get free updates on anything in life. I don't get a new stove for free every time Kenmore releases a newer one. I don't get a free upgrade on my car. And those things wear out. Software doesn't.

The Flux guys gave us a free upgrade to v2. They're basically giving their own labor away for free. However, they have to pay for the maps, so they can't give those away without bankrupting themselves. I really don't think that it is too much to ask for.

However, if you want to give your own time away for free, you could write a CF plugin that reads MapPoint or Streets & Trips or Delorme maps instead- or have it read google maps or openstreetmap data. Your choice. They give the SDK away for free, too.